Gandhis Nonviolence gave us Freedom?

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Gandhis Nonviolence gave us Freedom?
India Forum: Comments, Opinion - Information Resource

News Summary: World War II ended in the summer of 1945. In the General Election that followed, Churchill lost to Clement Atlee. With war-torn economy in shambles, Britain was in no shape to hang on to the vast colonial Empire. In March 1946 Atlee agreed to grant independence to India. The following years saw independence granted to many colonies - Burma, Ceylon, Ghana, Malaysia, British Guyana and others that had no history of freedom struggle. So it is correct to conclude that independence to India was a giv.....read more in: Gandhis Nonviolence gave us Freedom?

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Total 24 Comments

These comments are about: Gandhis Nonviolence gave us Freedom?

Srno	Comment on Current Thread
24	g kapuria on Wednesday, May 07, 2008 : As long as the Congress party rules India, the truth has no chance. People like Mayawati would give that credit to Ambedkar. But let"s not worry too much about who gets the credit. Think how our nation could have been different if there was no partition. If Pakistan and Bangladesh were part of India, Hindus would not have any rights at all. Why? According to Wikipedia: Bangladesh population 150 million, of which 135 million (90%) are Muslims, 13 million (9%) Hindus. Pakistan population 169 million, of which 162 million (96%) are Muslims, 3 million (1.85%) Hindus. India population 1132 million, of which 152 million (13.4%) are Muslims and 911 million (80.5%) Hindus. If we were together, we would have 1451 million people, of which Muslims would be 449 million (31%) Muslims and 927 million (63.8%) Hindus. In a country with 31% Muslims, and a whole bunch of secularists and a lot of Christians, there is no way in the world Hindus would have had any rights. Lets try to preserve what we have.
23	A.Moron on Thursday, May 01, 2008 : For the faults of the Congress party from 1918 to 1948 Gandhi alone is solely responsible as he was the DICTATOR of The Congress party. He has expelled every contemporary leaders in 1919 from the Congress party to make the organization full of his slaves and servants. There was no room for anyone to disagree even mildly with him. The persons who did that (Srinivas Igenger,Subhas Chandra Bose for example) got expelled. He alone took all the important and unimportant decisions. He and his followers like Patel and Nehru against the opinion of The Congress party Working committee took the decision to please Lord.Mountbatten and partition the country. It is a farce to say his method was non-violent. Violence do not need to be physical attacks. Verbal attacks and insults and conspiracy are also violent methods and Gandhi was very good at all these.
22	Meenakshi on Thursday, May 01, 2008 : A.Moron, I am not calling Gandhi a saint.Certainly not endorsing appeasement either.Made lots of errors of judgement.Is it not a fact that he wanted congress party disbanded? My point is, his life is a warning to any wannabe social reformer.Appeasement is obdurately entrenched amongst hindus in contemporary India.It would not be fair to lay the blame for the appalling state of affairs on one person alone.
21	A.Moron on Wednesday, April 30, 2008 : Corrections Meenakshi: How do you know that Gandhi had no ill will against Nathuram Godse. Who had read the mind of Gandhi at the time of his death? Gandhi all his life was most severe against anyone who have argued against his policy of appeasements towards both the British and the Muslims; although they were not against any non-violence political movement. He used to expell them mercilessly. He was never elected into any offices, but made a number of coups to get the power and to stay as the Dictator of The Congress. There was no election in 1918 when he had assumed the post of the President of The Congress Party without any election and wasted the Swaraj Fund of Rs.10 Lakhs collected by Tilak to finance Muslim Khilafat Movement. By him The Congress was reduced to a Gandhi party, where he alone would take all decisions disregarding any other opinion. Anyone who have expressed any different opinion ( even at the time of the partition of India) was expelled. The members of the Congress Working Committee who were against the partition proposal pf Gandhi were all expelled. Is this the sign of a Saint you are trying to project. A Saint with total disregard for democracy, total disregards for those who gave their lives for the Freedom movement. Gandhi used to insult the revolutionaries even when they were about to be hanged. When Jatin Das died after a hunger strike in Lahore prison demanding political status, Gandhi first said nothing, then said " I am silent because if I have to say something that would be only against Jatin Das". This was Gandhi. Gandhi started hunger strike to save the Muslims in Calcutta in 1947 when only a few miles east of Calcutta thousands of Hindus were getting slaughtered by the Muslims. Gandhi advised them to get killed by the Muslims but do not resist. When Hindu refugees from Pakistan took shelter in a Mosque in Delhi in 1947, Gandhi started hunger strike for their eviction. A great Saint indeed.
20	A.Moron on Wednesday, April 30, 2008 : Meenakshi: How do you know that Gandhi had ill will against Nathuram Godse, who had read the mind of Gandhi at the time of his death? Gandhi was all his life was most severe against anyone who have argued against his policy of appeasements towards both the British and the Muslims( but not against non-violence political movement). He used to expell them mecilessly. He was never elected into any offices, but made a number of coups to get the power and to stay as the Dictator of The Congress. By him The Congress was reduced to a Gandhi party, where he alone would take all decisions disregarding any other opinion. Anyone who have expressed any different opinion ( even at the time of the partition of India) was expelled. Is this the sign of a Saint you are trying to project. A Saint with total disregard for democracy, total disregards for those who gave their lives for the Freedom movement. Gandhi used to insult the revolutionaries even when they were about to be hanged. A great Saint indeed.
19	Meenakshi on Wednesday, April 30, 2008 : A well written article. That Mahatma Gandhi deserves our eulogies for many sterling qualities in him cannot be denied. One important lesson to be learnt is that this world just cannot be changed or reformed into a Paradise.However, what brings tears to my eyes is, I heard Gandhiji had a premonition He was going to be assassinated and asked Sri Kaanchi Shankaracharya to grant him a boon that should that happen, He should die bearing not a trace of illwill towards the killer . Ponder over it. How many of us would be able to think like Mahatma Gandhi?
18	S.Ghosh on Wednesday, April 30, 2008 : Gandhi was not a factor at all. Britain occupied India not for the love of the Indians but for profit. look at the big buildings in London and elsewhere and the Palaces: these are all made after they had Indian Empire with our money, but they never acknowledge. When India became unprofitable, costing too much to maintain, Britain just dumped it as bad investment. According to the British, they just transferred power to the Indians they can trust( people like Gandhi and other Congress leaders who were in 1947 all pro-British)).
17	S.Ghosh on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 : Clement Attlee said clearly that British never considered Gandhi as a factor to give India independence. Attlee said clearly that after the creation of Azad Hind Fauz and the revolt of the Indian Navy in 1946, British had no choce but to leave India because always there were only a handful of British in the Indian Army, which was mainly Indian. British in 1947 could not trust them anymore and Britain had no other resources to mobolize enough non-Indian soldiers to control India or any other big colonies in Asia. So they have concentrated their attention to African colonies which were much more profitable and easier to control. India was no longer a profitable colony and was impossible to control without Indian soldiers. Gandhi was a factor at all.
16	A.Moron on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 : Kalyan Viswanathan: Your view that Gandhi has initiated mass movement in India is false. There were many such mass movement in India. The Swadesi movement started in 1905 after the partition of Bengal was a non-violent political mass movement. The leaders of the Congress party at that time Tilak, Surendranath Banerjee, Chittaranjan Das, Anne Besant, Lajpat Rai were all non-violent politicians. Thus, there is nothing new in Gandhi at all. He was not the first person to advocate non-violent method. Revolutionaries active at that time were not in the Congress at all. They had Jugantar, Anushinal Samity, Gaddar Party as their organization; a lot of them escaped to the Soviet Inion and formed the CPI in 1920. Similarly Azad Hind Fauz was organized by Subhas Chandra Bose who was expelled from the Congress by Gandhi himself. The revolt in the Royal Indian Navy in 1946 was denounced by Gandhi. Gandhi was not involved in the Freedom movement as such, he used to expell everyone who had dared to raise the issue of complete indendence from the British. Gandhi said many times that he is proud to be a member of the most benevolent Empire the world has seen. He has recruited soldiers for the British Army during the First World War. It is also not true that Gandhi has initiated the movement against untouchability. It was started with Raja Rammohan Roy, then Swami Dayananda, Swami Vivekananda--- they were all against untouchability and caste system. Gandhi has the advantage of the suppoprt of the British mass media and the Indian top businressmen like Birla and Bajaj.that was the reason for this Gandhi Propaganda Industry.
15	Surprised Citizen on Monday, April 28, 2008 : The article presents a convincing argument to prove that nonviolence is an unproven force. It backs the argument with historical events. This is new knowledge to me. There may be some flaws in the argument and historians should examine it further.
14	Truth Speaks on Monday, April 28, 2008 : Kalyan Viswanathan, Thanks to coward Gandhi"s Nonviolence, we have rampant Islamic Terrorism every where in the contry. Do you want more?
13	Kalyan Viswanathan on Monday, April 28, 2008 : I have read much about Gandhi - books that are both positive about him, as well as books that are extremely negative about him. On the whole, despite the fact that Gandhi"s blind-spot for the Muslims in the name of Hindu-Muslim Unity, tended to put Hindus at a severe dis-advantage, I am unable to bring myself to criticize Gandhi so whole-heartedly as many are able to do. Gandhi failed to read the Muslims correctly - That was on the whole his main error of judgement. His position regarding the British, that they could be "shamed into leaving India", by simply appealing to their better judgement, their better conscience through the instrument of non-violence was in my mind, an innovation in political thought that deserves the highest recognition. Whether it was directly or only partially responsible for India"s obtaining freedom, is something we cannot fully determine now, without much more deeper study into the British psyche, in the years from 1940 through 1947. His position regarding the Hindu society at large, the need for internal reformation, the removal of untouchability, and his unceasing commitment to raise the awareness of the masses of India, are all absolutely admirable. I am concerned, though that the spirit of "debate" and "inquiry" that can potentially lead us to a greater level of insight and light on these topics, too often gives way on these web sites and chat forums, into quick personal attacks on one another. I wish on the whole, we could upgrade the quality of the discussion, without trashing each other.
12	R.Sharma on Monday, April 28, 2008 : Indian people have committed a lot of sins: caste system, Sati, multiple marriages, total disregards for the poor, unhygenic behaviours. So as a result of all these bad Karmas we got the Curse in the Shape of Gandhi.
11	A.Moron on Monday, April 28, 2008 : Gopal Alankar: You are writing something which is nothing but simple propaganda: non-violence of Gandhi has not achieved freedom at all. Clement Attlee, the PM of UK who had transferred power in 1947 said so clearly. Gandhi was noy non-violent either. They way he has treated Subhas Chandra Bose and his 250 followers by driving them out of The Congress illegally after Bose won the election to be the President of the Congress in 1939 demonstrated very clearly that Gandhi was a violent man in a way. Gandhi was not for democracy, he was not elected into any post of The Congress, he has never willing to organise any election but he was a Dictator within the Congress. He has forced The Congress to accept the partition of India without consulting the party members or the Congress Councils. He was a liar as well. In 1943 he along with his son-in-law Rajagopalacharya made an elaborate plan to partition India but in public he was saying partition can happen only over his dead-body. He was against the progressive Muslims but used to consider Jinnah as his son. He has refused to accept Fazlul Haque of Bengal in The Congress party in 1938; otherwise The Muslim League could not get any foothold in Bengal. He has refused to accept Balochistan within India in 1947, although Khan of Kalat wanted to join India. Similarly according to the words of Khan Abdul Gaffer Khan, Gandhi had thrown away NWFP to the wolves of Pakistan. Know the facts, rather than to proagate for a useless doctrine of Passive Resistence of Gandhi, which is not non-violence but cowardism. Imagine Lord Rama doing Satyagraha in front of the palace of Ravana or Arjun doing satyagraha in front of Judhistir. Nathuram Godse was the best friend of Gandhi; he made him a hero; otherwise nobody would give a monkey about Gandhi today.
10	S.Ghosh on Monday, April 28, 2008 : India would have a much better future if Gandhi had decided not to return back to India from South Africa.
9	hindu on Monday, April 28, 2008 : bleeding hearts are the macauleys children still honouring gandhi who was responsible for slaughter of hindus in noakhali by calling for shanti when hindus were oppressed by muslims i for one don"t understand the indians fixation with gandhi- he was nothing more than a naked fakir as churchill said-
8	A.Moron on Monday, April 28, 2008 : Kalyan Viswanathan: Your view about India in 1915 was totally wrong. Congress was transformed in 1905 by the Swadesi movement during the partition of Bengal into a mass political movement. There was no need for Gandhi at all as he was a protege of Gokhale, who was a pro-Birish to the core. In 1915 there were leaders like Surendranath Banerjee, Bipin Pal, Lajpat Rai, Tilak, Chittaranjan Das, anne Besant, and among the Muslims Ali brothers. Tilak died, Lajpat Rai got killed by the British, Chittaranjan Das, Bipin Pal, Surendranath Banerjee, Anne Besant were expelled from the Congress and Gandhi took over with the support of the fanatic Muslims to create Khilafat Movement. Don"t call it non-cooperation movement, because it had nothing to do with the freedom movement at all. Since then Gandhi used to expel everyone who wanted to fight for freedom. He used to use the most vile words for the revolutionaries when they were about to be hanged. India got independence despite of Gandhi not because of Gandhi. Gandhi"s role was to sabotage the freedom movement to give credit to the British, as he was an Empire loyalist to the core. Nocoperation= Khilafat Movement Civil disobidience= Gandhi disasociated himself after only 7 days without any effect. Salt March= no effect on salt tax 1942= Gandhi disassociated from it after only 4 days; thereafter he used to have breakfast with the viceroy in the Simla Palace( a great prison indeed). He used to be protected by the British secret service people dressed up as very poor beggers. Why??? 1942= lasted only 5 days
7	Kalyan Viswanathan on Monday, April 28, 2008 : There is a tendency amongst those who love Hinduism, to somehow come around to denigrating Gandhi. Gandhi"s contribution must be seen in the light of the fact that at the time, when he came back to India from South Africa, the Indian National Congress was mostly an isolated, motley group of elitist, educated Indians. Gandhi saw clearly that in order for the Indians to challenge the might of the British Empire, they had to rise against the British as an entire nation, not just a few lawyers and British educated Indians. He also saw that the vast poverty stricken masses of India were in no position to challenge the British in any kind of violent confrontation, without inviting a terribly violent and one-sided retaliation. In a confrontation of unequals, Gandhi devised Non-Violence, Non-co-operation and Civil disobedience as a vehicle through which the vast masses of India could offer a form of protest against the British. His method also took into account the fact that there was an inherent conflict in the trajectory of British politics in Britain, which was becoming more liberal, democratic and inclusive, and their colonial designs, which was in opposition to everything they were saying they stood for at home. Obviously Gandhi could not have foreseen the rise of Hitler and the impact he would have on Britain and its colonies. The argument that India would have won its independence with or without Gandhi, because of the World War II, is really not a valid argument to diminish Gandhi"s contribution to India"s freedom struggle. Perhaps the one area where Gandhi had a blind spot, was around his reading of the Muslim leaue, and his own ability to effect some kind of transformation in the Hindu-Muslim situation. But as regards to Non-violence, he was right on, and he must be credited for transfroming a fringe movement for Freedom, into a national aspiration that touched people across the length and breadth of the country. Let us tread lightly when it comes to criticizing Gandhi - For we end up often exposing our own limitations and bias, when we set out to challenge and criticize a great man such as Gandhi.
6	Gopal Alankar on Sunday, April 27, 2008 : Some readers sought clarification on the objective of my article. One wished to know whether Gandhi did a good thing or a bad thing. Another believed that my article tacitly implied that Gandhi was not right. One other stated that the article was very detailed. Here is my explanation. The article provided lengthy details to prove that nonviolence did not work either in South Africa or in India. It also highlighted the fact that in the ongoing geopolitical conflicts there are no takers for non-violence on either side of the fence. This, however, did not imply that nonviolence is doomed to failure in future applications. It only implied that nonviolence to this day has no proven track record of success. Despite its failures, I strongly believe that it will work well on righteous minds. But unfortunately, Churchill was no righteous mind. Gandhi was not wrong in propagating nonviolence. It was an appropriate tool for the times because by its nature, nonviolence avoids the loss of precious lives. But more important, it served as a catalyst to rally the Indian masses to the cause of freedom struggle and it spread the awareness for independence in length and breadth of India. The reason for winning the Independence was not non-violence. It was the outcome of the decision of the British to leave all their colonies on economic grounds. Gopal Alankar, Author
5	Truth Speaks on Friday, April 25, 2008 : Gandhis Nonviolence is the reason for Partition and created Pakistan.
4	Naveen on Friday, April 25, 2008 : Subhash Chandra Bose and Bhagat Singh are real heroes who sacrificed everything for india. Remember, it"s bose who travel through underground submarine from germans encircling entire africa in horribel health conditions. Every indian has to salute those legends and not those(who hide in Italian embassy during 1971 war, and not those who had illegal contact with mountbatten"s wife(used to meet her in the mid night shame for a prime minister) and not those who didn"t tried to prevent the execution of our BHAGAT SINGH).
3	R.Sharma on Thursday, April 24, 2008 : I think the author of this article has copied everything from a primary school text book meant for the 7 years old. The author should have more respect for the readers of this Indiacause.com
2	hindu on Thursday, April 24, 2008 : gandhi did nothing for indias freedom infact he and nehru carved up india bhagat singh,bose were the ones who were instrumental in getting india to independence
1	A.Moron on Thursday, April 24, 2008 : This is again a Congress Party and British propaganda. Gandhi did almost nothing for our independence. The author should read first, then write.
1

Gandhis Nonviolence gave us Freedom? - Thread over

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and when hindus/buddhist/sikhs get slaughtered by muslims the nation is not pained.these secularists news medias are all anti-hindu and anti-national.i say shut these media outlets straight away

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	Arunaachalaa on Thursday, July 03, 2008 : The inshaallah muslims ought to accept whatever befalls them as "InshaAllah ". How come the treacherous, treasonous multi forked cheats & liars called ndtv, cnnibn and so forth have not been PULVERISED yet???

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HISTORY ACCORDING TO SO CALLED "Dr Basu" darjeeling goes back to Sikkim and Sikkim becomes a independent,sovereign country just like how it use to be before annexation or should i say "conquered" quick question ??? how come your so called "researched history" or should i say expert ,, missed the most important part????

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JOJO on Thursday, July 03, 2008 : Ghosh,,,now why blame India??? i suggest you do more research on Indian history even before civilization ,so you might get some knowledge regarding immigrations and when you are done take some crash course on Indian Constitution and preamble finall....

S.Ghosh on Thursday, July 03, 2008 : India is a soft state, there is no administration, no laws. So, it is possible for a convicted killer from Nepal to come to Assam to be a MP and a minister until he was exposed by a news media. Exactly in the same way a Nepalese can be the Chief Mini....

S.Ghosh on Thursday, July 03, 2008 : "Bhutia comes from a Buddhist Bhutia background" ( According to Wikipedia) Pawan Chamling is another Nepalese who became the Chief Minister of Sikkim, as the Nepalese immigrants now have occupied Sikkim by driving out the Chwgiyal of Sikkim. As a r....

Upendra on Wednesday, July 02, 2008 : This S. Ghosh dude says please see # 48..... "What I wrote are facts. Nepalese cannot be Indian, as Nepal is a seperate country. Yes, Pawan Chamling is a Nepalese not an Indian, his ancestors came from Nepal. Baichung Bhutia is very proud to be a Bhu....

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Then fix it.

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There is progress for you.

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Thank you "Muslims First" Manmohan Singh and Hindu hating Sonia for giving a free hand to Islamic Terrorists and Maoist Terrorist to mass murder Hindus.

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I like it. Drinking and driving should even punishable by death if the driver kills someone.

Gandhis Nonviolence gave us Freedom?

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